“Yeah, but your scientists were so preoccupied with whether or not they could, they didn't stop to think if they should.” This summarizes modern science and medicine. I was horrified when it came out that Fauci was involved in experiments in Tunisia on beagles that was nothing short of pointless torture and felt sure the AVMA would come out strongly against him and similar programs. After all the reason this “science” was exported to Tunisia is because no scientific ethics board would approve it. Outsourcing such science is nothing but a way to avoid the sort of ethical review that the AVMA demands in the U.S. Instead they doubled down their support for Fauci and on how “necessary” such research was and they remained silent on the obvious disregard for ethical scientific inquiry. They did it because they bought hook line and sinker into the Covid hysteria and refused to question their Patron Saint of science, Fauci. They are buying into the DEI crap as well and as my boss says the only thing JAVMA is useful for is checking out the obituaries.
I wonder how many parents tell their IVF children how they were “created”? Has there been a study done to assess what kind of impact that would have on the children? In my opinion, IVF is just another example of scientists playing at being God and gullible wannabe parents going along with it. How far is far enough when it comes to tampering with God’s creation?
My five beautiful grandchildren were conceived in a Petri dish and they all know how they were created. They know they were wanted and God loves them. Their parents are the most incredible loving, caring, selfless servants of God. Our daughter is a pediatric RN and her husband is a pastor. He was born with “Congenital bilateral absence of the vas deferens (CBAVD)…it is clinically characterized by the absence of the bilateral vas deferens; the main clinical manifestation is infertility, accounting for 1–2% of male infertility cases.” He is a carrier of CF. Testing showed that our daughter was not, so they went ahead with ICSI (after he had surgery twice to retrieve sperm) and were blessed with their incredible children which they never could have had without IVF and an amazingly talented doctor. They did not test any embryos—they prayed a lot, and trusted God. Just as in “normally” conceived embryos, some did not make it, but she delivered 5 healthy children, from frozen embryos.
[ I had 3 miscarriages myself—conceived the old fashioned way—who knows why? But carried 4 healthy children to term.]
If you met my grandchildren, you might change your mind of your view of “gullible wannabe parents” and the impact of IVF on children. I praise God that He gifted people with minds to conceive ways to help couples who desperately want to be and should be parents.
I’m always willing to change my mind when provided with a convincing perspective. I apologize for the gullible parents remark. I think that some people might use IVF for vain reasons—to select the sex of the child or to eliminate the possibility of “defects.” Obviously, as in your son-in-law’s case, there are medical reasons to pursue this method.
I, sadly, have run into IVF children who have been told how they were "created" and now feel a life-long allegiance to IVF itself.
I completely agree that IVF is playing God and using medicine and technology to do what 'can' be done with extremely little regard for what 'should' be done. The entire existence of IVF is inhumane, or perhaps anti-human. Where is the magical, mystical beauty of being able to say with the Psalmist that you were knit together in your mother's womb by the Lord God? If I know that my 'creation' was just a matter of well meaning scientists manipulating my parent's sperm and egg, what connection do I share with that greater narrative? Where is my place in any story greater than a medical pamphlet? We would do well to leave this abhorrent technology alone.
Thankfully the Lord is merciful and even in IVF is ultimately the one who directs and gives life, despite our best attempts to prove otherwise.
My heart is with parents who cannot conceive a child naturally.
After i reread my initial posting words, i removed gender bias and tried to put myself in other moccasins. So i rewrote that first sentence and paused. Does everyone "deserve" to be a parent? Is this thing called parenthood a right?
Now, with the technology willing and enabling ALL to become baby mamas & papas, i ask Dr G & these illustrious readers:
who decides which people get to be parents?
If we're splicing and dicing, freezing & thawing, is it cool to create & kill? Can you turn things off after you've gone too far?
Are money babies vanity choices or love multipliers?
Where do YOU draw that line, and do you agree with me that i believe we've already started sliding down the slippery slope.
At what point, and who says, "It's my right and the state must pay!" Or, who says, "The fetus is too (something), and must be ended!" Is a zygote a fetus to protect? Is a fetus absolutely a life worth protecting?
In conceiving my children we had fertility struggles, and unfortunately ended up at a fertility clinic. this was 25 years ago, and back then you were able to elect to do IVF without cryo and testing, interesting. that is a new "necessity" - and I assume from my experience with that very-highly-regarded clinic that this makes them a lot of money. Fertility medicine was then and is now a total Wild West environment - there is no oversight. We ended up being "failures" and leaving the clinic quite unhappily; one visit to a very good urologist later, and my husband's severe torsion was repaired and we were able to have children. ALL THE SPERM DONATIONS we did were NEVER TESTED. we were on a conveyor belt like this testFemale - drugFemale - IUI - IVF. that was patient protocol for everyone.
I am not anti-IVF, but I am all for having some restrictions much like other western countries have. Absolutely no donating unused embryos to research and a limit on the number of embryos produced and stored.
In the immortal words of Dr Ian Malcom:
“Yeah, but your scientists were so preoccupied with whether or not they could, they didn't stop to think if they should.” This summarizes modern science and medicine. I was horrified when it came out that Fauci was involved in experiments in Tunisia on beagles that was nothing short of pointless torture and felt sure the AVMA would come out strongly against him and similar programs. After all the reason this “science” was exported to Tunisia is because no scientific ethics board would approve it. Outsourcing such science is nothing but a way to avoid the sort of ethical review that the AVMA demands in the U.S. Instead they doubled down their support for Fauci and on how “necessary” such research was and they remained silent on the obvious disregard for ethical scientific inquiry. They did it because they bought hook line and sinker into the Covid hysteria and refused to question their Patron Saint of science, Fauci. They are buying into the DEI crap as well and as my boss says the only thing JAVMA is useful for is checking out the obituaries.
I wonder how many parents tell their IVF children how they were “created”? Has there been a study done to assess what kind of impact that would have on the children? In my opinion, IVF is just another example of scientists playing at being God and gullible wannabe parents going along with it. How far is far enough when it comes to tampering with God’s creation?
My five beautiful grandchildren were conceived in a Petri dish and they all know how they were created. They know they were wanted and God loves them. Their parents are the most incredible loving, caring, selfless servants of God. Our daughter is a pediatric RN and her husband is a pastor. He was born with “Congenital bilateral absence of the vas deferens (CBAVD)…it is clinically characterized by the absence of the bilateral vas deferens; the main clinical manifestation is infertility, accounting for 1–2% of male infertility cases.” He is a carrier of CF. Testing showed that our daughter was not, so they went ahead with ICSI (after he had surgery twice to retrieve sperm) and were blessed with their incredible children which they never could have had without IVF and an amazingly talented doctor. They did not test any embryos—they prayed a lot, and trusted God. Just as in “normally” conceived embryos, some did not make it, but she delivered 5 healthy children, from frozen embryos.
[ I had 3 miscarriages myself—conceived the old fashioned way—who knows why? But carried 4 healthy children to term.]
If you met my grandchildren, you might change your mind of your view of “gullible wannabe parents” and the impact of IVF on children. I praise God that He gifted people with minds to conceive ways to help couples who desperately want to be and should be parents.
I’m always willing to change my mind when provided with a convincing perspective. I apologize for the gullible parents remark. I think that some people might use IVF for vain reasons—to select the sex of the child or to eliminate the possibility of “defects.” Obviously, as in your son-in-law’s case, there are medical reasons to pursue this method.
I, sadly, have run into IVF children who have been told how they were "created" and now feel a life-long allegiance to IVF itself.
I completely agree that IVF is playing God and using medicine and technology to do what 'can' be done with extremely little regard for what 'should' be done. The entire existence of IVF is inhumane, or perhaps anti-human. Where is the magical, mystical beauty of being able to say with the Psalmist that you were knit together in your mother's womb by the Lord God? If I know that my 'creation' was just a matter of well meaning scientists manipulating my parent's sperm and egg, what connection do I share with that greater narrative? Where is my place in any story greater than a medical pamphlet? We would do well to leave this abhorrent technology alone.
Thankfully the Lord is merciful and even in IVF is ultimately the one who directs and gives life, despite our best attempts to prove otherwise.
My heart is with parents who cannot conceive a child naturally.
After i reread my initial posting words, i removed gender bias and tried to put myself in other moccasins. So i rewrote that first sentence and paused. Does everyone "deserve" to be a parent? Is this thing called parenthood a right?
Now, with the technology willing and enabling ALL to become baby mamas & papas, i ask Dr G & these illustrious readers:
who decides which people get to be parents?
If we're splicing and dicing, freezing & thawing, is it cool to create & kill? Can you turn things off after you've gone too far?
Are money babies vanity choices or love multipliers?
Where do YOU draw that line, and do you agree with me that i believe we've already started sliding down the slippery slope.
At what point, and who says, "It's my right and the state must pay!" Or, who says, "The fetus is too (something), and must be ended!" Is a zygote a fetus to protect? Is a fetus absolutely a life worth protecting?
Loved this article. Thank you, Adrian
In conceiving my children we had fertility struggles, and unfortunately ended up at a fertility clinic. this was 25 years ago, and back then you were able to elect to do IVF without cryo and testing, interesting. that is a new "necessity" - and I assume from my experience with that very-highly-regarded clinic that this makes them a lot of money. Fertility medicine was then and is now a total Wild West environment - there is no oversight. We ended up being "failures" and leaving the clinic quite unhappily; one visit to a very good urologist later, and my husband's severe torsion was repaired and we were able to have children. ALL THE SPERM DONATIONS we did were NEVER TESTED. we were on a conveyor belt like this testFemale - drugFemale - IUI - IVF. that was patient protocol for everyone.
Cannot love this post enough. It made me laugh out loud even in the midst of the deepest sickness of this world.
Excellence dear Sir!! 🎯
I am not anti-IVF, but I am all for having some restrictions much like other western countries have. Absolutely no donating unused embryos to research and a limit on the number of embryos produced and stored.